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Post by Numberate on Jul 7, 2005 17:55:54 GMT 12
Can we get a discussion about this going? I just wrote out a big post about it but it errored on submission.
Basically there are 8 slots and it's currently a free-for-all with debuffs at the moment. I'm just after 1 slot for curse of shadows in UBRS and 2 for curse of elements and immolate in Strath or Scholo - both increase all the locks and mages damage considerably.
I realise there are other MUST debuffs but there are also a ton of inappropriate or just plain weak ones going up. I think we need to come up with a list of the 6 main slot takers and keep the other 1 or 2 free for those oddball % talent debuffs that go off without any control.
Comments?
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Post by Sagan on Jul 11, 2005 14:02:20 GMT 12
I would also like to see some views on this. As a tank we probably need one slot for sunder armor which is one of our main aggro holders. A problem is that alot of warriors (myself included) have the deep wounds talent that procs on a crit and takes up a slot.
I'm not sure whether i should be using shouts and/or things like tunderclap on raids as they all take up slots.
Also having enchants or weapons with debuff procs is probably a no no (ie phantom blade).
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Fawa
Grunt
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Post by Fawa on Jul 11, 2005 16:40:01 GMT 12
Tis interesting question.
Current I would say Rogue poison and Mage fire debuffs are the main reason all the others get knocked off.
Do rogues realy need to use poison during raids - I wont answer best they do.
Mages however is a problem as a build which dident use these talents would probably be quite hard to make and not very good for PvP. Unless we have our mages only use Arcane Missile's
Please discuss...
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Post by Galf on Jul 12, 2005 8:03:19 GMT 12
Mages could just use Arcane Missile's, and some of there fire spells that don't do DOT, but if they get a crit with there fire spells its going to do a very high DOT. When I do instances I tend to only use arcane missiles as there is not much point of doing anything else
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Post by Numberate on Jul 12, 2005 10:35:12 GMT 12
Good to get some replies going now about this. Sunder Armor as mentioned is a pretty vial debuff but I don't really know what else is needed. I guess if for UBRS/MC we draw a list like:
/Sundar Armour/Curse of Shadows (or elements)/ ? / ? / ? / ? / Free* / Free* /
* For talent or weapon procs that can't be controlled.
My person opinion is that in large scale instances, when attacking things like the Beast, things like Syphon life, Moonfire, Farie Fire, Shadow Word Pain, Corruption, Rend shouldn't go up. Also Shamans should use Earth Shock instead of Frost/Fire shock to keep off the the little debuffs.
Would be good to get some comments from Rogues and Hunters too.
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Post by Cataclysm on Jul 12, 2005 12:37:33 GMT 12
If curse of elements is going to be applied, there needs to be a slot for a mage elemental spell. Since most mages at lvl 60 are going to be frost specced, that will be frostbolt 60% speed reduction. There is no ignite effect for frost.
A heavily frost specced mage will also have a 45% chance of freezing their enemies with a frost spell, which will also take a debuff slot. I personally am staying away from this talent because it confounds AoEing, but it should be recognized as a future issue. The use of mage armor over ice armor will negate the possibility of taking a slot with the ice armor "chill" effect.
Any druids want to comment on Faire fires effectiveness in endgame?
Just an idea, but if we had 10 locks in MC with curse of doom, wouldn't that do 32k dmg unresistable in 1 min, so in a battle 5 min long, thats 160k dmg from just the locks? That sounds insane. What's the downside to this, lube?
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Fawa
Grunt
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Post by Fawa on Jul 12, 2005 21:48:02 GMT 12
Also I think I have seen Mobs effected by the same debuff from different players which will whip them even quicker.
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Post by Khyshaan on Jul 12, 2005 22:45:53 GMT 12
I don't tend to dot in instances anymore. Just when grinding. I don't think it makes much difference as a priest really.
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Post by Edakupeta on Jul 13, 2005 14:38:27 GMT 12
....I fully have no idea what any of you are talking about  |
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Post by Numberate on Jul 14, 2005 1:07:02 GMT 12
"if we had 10 locks in MC with curse of doom, wouldn't that do 32k dmg unresistable in 1 min"
Heh good point but I'd love to see locks to the point where theyre so popular that there's 10 in MC at once.
Basically most people moan when the see curse of doom go up as it takes a slot each for 60 secs and on a lot of occasions the mob could be dead by then. In MC probably not but if you have say 2 locks in there then if aggreed one could put up COD and the other COS as the amount of damage created by the COS in the same time would be 10 times the amount. Also COD does have the timer set on the cast and not the hit so if it resists then that's it for another minute.
Your other point about the frost mage cold debuff proc is valid. Those are the things we just have to allow for as it's not something that can be easlily turned off. We may find out that we need to keep more than 2 slots free for random ones like that.
I'm not too sure about anyone elses observations but I've really only seen mages stick with arcane missiles in MC and I'm guessing it might be because COE is bugged and doesn't assist cold damage as it should. Fire is just pointless in there.
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